Almost two years have gone by since I opened this thread. 164 replies. Over 133,000 views. And Led Zeppelin is still over rated. But it's been fun. I wonder if any artist related thread has more views or comments. (I use the term "artist" loosely.)

Scanning through the comments, I have to respond to one thing: the theft of song writing credit. Yeah sure, others did it too but that doesn't justify LZ's theft. The important point is that they were internationally famous from day one and the size of the theft matters. And they had to know the men and women they were stealing from could use the money. Was it arrogance? Was it racism? (Some old n___ isn’t going to be able to beat our lawyers.)

Someone from Toronto slagged America for turning its back on the blues and and how it took skinny British boys to bring the music the attention it deserves. True. But the point is if skinny British boys are to be commended for revitalizing the blues isn’t LZ even more rotten for having stolen it? I think an artist I would rather be ignored than robbed.

Anyone know if current pressings have restored the credit to the real authors of the songs? I hope so.

I'll leave the screeching, guitar wanking and statutory rape for another day.

TorontoRox:

Lol ... there's always a little American exceptionalism in these comments that slag Zeppelin, i.e., that he was stealing from the Delta Bluesmen ...

Why not admit that, until Elvis, most of your white culture ignored the Delta blues completely?  The fact is Elvis put a few tunes on the chart and then got swamped by the likes of  Pat Boone, etc. 

I think it is a historical fact that you Americans completely turned from the blues.  Now you want to guard them as your own?

It was the British bands that brought back the blues, Bilko, so you should be thanking them, even if Zeppelin was a lousy live act ...

And I have critical credentials on that score ... I saw the same tour in 1969, the one supporting the release of Zeppelin II, in Toronto, and they were terrible ... Page was off on his own tangents, as if he was playing a different tune.  Bonham's drumming stole the show, in fact ...

Yes, they had also dropped Tull from the tour by the Toronto stop, sometime in November ... a local act, ironically, Subway Elvis, opened, followed by Edward Bear ... so no chance of being upstaged at that point.

--- Rob

Toronto

I have a recording of this show, 11/2/1969 at the O'Keefe Center.  I'm a huge fan, but, attempting to stay objective, this show is excellent.  The usual long numbers are kept relatively short, and Page certainly plays within their confines.  Again (like the reviews from several people in this thread), I believe your memory has been altered by the influences of popular culture (39 years is a long time...). 

 

Secondly, this was a different tour from the one that had Tull as an opener.  So, rather than saying Tull was dropped to prevent Zep from being upstaged (which never happened), they weren't even in it from the start.

The worst singer??? Most overrated band in rock HISTORY???? Maybe you saw them on a really bad night, which is very possible. But for the worse singer in the most overrated band they sure have influenced millions (including myself to pick up a guitar and play real music) - To me , that speaks volumes...much more then your opinion on one show you saw 40 years ago.... Everyone has bad nights. Every album is a classic, they never really wrote a BAD song. Descibing the power of Zeppelins music cannot be described in words. It has stood the test of time and it couldn't have been done without each member as they are. There's not another rock band today or yesterday that has continuously produced good rock music album after album. You can't argue that point. If you do, you simply don't like Zeppelin (which is obvious) Not bad for a band with the worse singer.......

I know people on this page are throwing a fit over this but you guys have to respect that this is that person's OPINION!!!!

Personally I agree that Zeppelin is mediocre and boring to me. But that's just my opinion. I'm just more into bands that are more unique like Santana, Cream, Brian Wilson, etc...

To a musician like me, I don't understand the cult status of band that seems marginal to me.

Oh yeah and Rock Historian?

You made the worst argument for Led Zeppelin ever! And I mean ever!

Other bands have made good albums one after another. Bands like I don't know, THE BEATLES? Ring any bells? Or Jimi Hendrix? The who? Cream?

I'm sorry but that was a terrible argument

you are crazy i am 11 and i think zepplin is best tied with the black crowes

I have heard both good and bad live Zeppelin. Plant never seemed to be able to sing The Song Remains The Same without his voice cracking. Page's solos often did sound like wanking (Trampled Under Foot) but it's also true that they never played the same thing twice and they could both sound excellent at the same show (Dazed and Confused, Since I've been Loving You, No Quarter). And it's also true that I was not a fan until I saw them in 77'. And they instantly became one of my favorite bands. Ok, so they "borrowed" a lot of lyrics from others without credit; they also gave credit. I think that musically one would be hard pressed to identify any of those songs without the vocal line as having come from somewhere else. Here's the deal: if it was "the critics" who were so enamoured with the band you might be able to say that they are overrated but "the critics" didn't like them any more than you do. Thier popularity came from the record and ticket buying rock fan. The word overrated simply cannot apply to this band without you saying that another persons opinion is crap. And then, of course, you leave yourself open to the same charge.

I just dont understand you people. You all must be from Mars or Jupiter. I am so thankfull I was born to the RIGHT generation!!!!!!!!!!!!

Led Zep and many of their contemporaries can be properly accused of overwrought blues jamming. Fact is that they and many bands of their ilk have dated pretty badly. The hip hop crowd that have sampled their best beats and riffs actually make Zep sound a more exciting proposition than they were/are. And as for the Hobbitey folk songs...

However, saw Plant and Alison Krauss a while back and he didn't seem to have any tuning problems then. Only problem he had was that she blew him off the stage, though he seemed to realise this and take it with good humour.

incorrect, the Beatles had a few shitty albums, and so definitely did the Who
not that i don't love both of those bands
Zeppelin had constant perfection pumping  out of every song on every album
and unmatched vocals, guitar, bass, and drums

That's pathetic, for one why would you rather no one listen to your music than have people thinking it's so good they want to copy it? That' the point of music for the most part is it not?
also, dont go bitching about Led Zeppelin's fucked up antics, name me an awesome bands from the 70's that DIDN'T *** *** up and do insane drug-addled questionable things.

Pejorative judgements "worst"...or "best" should be limited to quantitative matters---in matters of taste and art, for example the recorded live music of Led Zeppelin. Not worst, not best, but obviously a major contender. Unique. And most drummers cite Bonzo as the finest 'rock' drummer. Even jazz legend Tony Williams felt that way. John Bonham was the drummer's drummer. And still is if you are interested in learning to play rock n'roll drumming. If you like broccoli, then great; but if you love cauliflower, then that does not make broccoli 'worst'.

Many drummers today are obsessed with double pedal bass drumming. Frankly I prefer Bonzo's right foot! :) But most of all the way he 'composed' his drum parts. He laid the foundational rhythmic structure over which Jimmy Page could 'weave' melodic and harmonic lines and modes. That is why you cannot have a Zeppelin after Bonham died with the exception of Jason Bonham, who was trained by Bonzo (witness the cinematic scenes in The Song Remains The Same). For Beatle fans it was with regret to watch the fab four being seconded when LZ took 'top of the pops' or whatever accolade. Even so, if a finer musical background for the Lord of the Rings were ever written, I cannot imagine what it would be. "No Quarter"...The eponymous: "California sunlight, sweet Calcutta rain, Honolulu starbright---the song remains the same..." Here you have top notch verse, as good as McCartney. Next you have a lightning rhythm guitar style, punctuated with a syncopated bass line and absolutely rocking drumwork! If you really look at what Bonham is playing and appreciate the drumming artistry embedded there, then you will have little time to criticize music in men devoted to their passion. To find a more dedicated guitarist, vocalist, bassist, drummer doesn't even make sense... Each band has their own piece of the spark.

Any self-respecting Led Zeppelin fan knows a lot about them with all their connections with the blues and Jimmy Page's time with Yardbirds. And there really is need for a PhD thesis on it. Zep's music is influenced by more than just the blues. Try listening to Zep 3. Ok, Since I've been Loving You, but the rest of the album is very ecelectic. Same for Zep 4, Houses of the Holy, Graffiti and Presence, the last track of which is, yes, another blues but sounds like a self-composed piece (quite brilliant too). So, I say listen to Son House thru' to Zeppelin and you'll hear all the influences just run through all blues artists.

Yes, I agree , this must be the biggest non-educated dumbass young punk that just doesn't know any better. You have displayed your' ignorance to the point of embarrassment. You are obviously a boy George/ George Micheals  fan who knows nothing about rock music or creativity. Please , keep these insanely ignorant thoughts to your' journal, which I am sure you  probably write all of your' inner most feminie thoughts. It's O.k. , just find another site such as one that features the backstreet boys or flock of seagulls. This is probably more your' speed. As it is painfully obvious that you spe

ak with no knowledge of the subject. Do us all a favor and come out of the closet and go have fun staying at the "YMCA"!

You are truely the little *** I believe we all thought you were. You remind me of that feckless little *** in high school who would go tell on someone for burning a " mariuaghna cigarrette" before school. I'm sorry you were probably picked on and teased, because you have displayed your' ignorance and insecurity issues to the point of mental challenges caused by what I am sure( based on your' fear of threats taken literally) is probably "mommy issues". You were probably *** fed until you were 12. Go find another topic to expound on, because your' opinion is oozing with total ignorance and lack of any substance other than your' *** since of  what a great band whos' creativity was legendary not to mention GOD given talent displayed by each member. So, go back to mommy or wine to the moderator like the little *** you have shown yourself to be. Try to stay away from old rock because your' ignorance scares me. Go back and get your' GED and leave your' moms *** alone. Grow up! You poor pitiful dipsh*t!